Bishop Walsh basketball. Missed opportunity.

[ravemwp]

Let me preface this by saying I am a BW alum. I support what BW is trying to do with its national basketball program. I know that people in the BW community would love for the Cumberland communities to embrace what Walsh is trying to do, and help bring positive attention to the region. That support is a two way street. I attended the BKIS at Allegany College and noticed that it was well attended by many players, as well as coaches from Fort Hill, and Allegany. I attended the Bowers Christmas tournament at Allegany the past two evenings. While it was a very entertaining tournament, I believe the BW basketball program missed an opportunity to embrace the local basketball community with some sort of presence in attending this tournament. I realize that the players are probably out of town with their families during the Christmas break, but I'm sure that some coaches, and administrators from BW are around. I know that the level of basketball is not the same as the BW schedule, but it is still high school student athletes working their butts off. If there is one thing I know about the people of Cumberland is that if you embrace them, they in turn will embrace you. It's a Western Maryland thing. I feel as though Bishop Walsh missed an opportunity to help heal some old wounds over the past two days by lack of presence. Especially with teams featuring Mikey Allen, and Chazz Imes who played together at BW as freshman. The healing process for Cumberland basketball will take some time, but it needs to be a group effort by all three city schools. Remember at the end of the day it's always about the student athletes. Do better BW. Just one man's opinion.

 

[BurgundyHoops]

do more for the community!? what more do you expect? The team has successfully brought national attention to the area, included local schools in the BKIS, created jobs, revenue for the city, all while helping to keep the doors of the school open. yet, their burgundy team still cant get a local game within the county "because they aren't local kids". last time i checked, Pallotti doesn't play with "local kids" either. Its the same bullshit IMO that has existed for years-well before BW had the program is does today. I don't think they should be required to "show up" to a tournament when the burgundy team can't even get on the schedule. would it be nice to show support for the other programs? sure! but come on, give the burgundy kids some games!

 

[Bleedred4life]

Someone is living on Fantasy Island! Da Plane, Da Plane. National attention, now that's funny!

 

[BurgundyHoops]

ok boomer

 

[JArmstrong]

I may be wrong on this, but I don’t think that scheduling BW’s Burgundy team would count as a game for state playoff points for Maryland public schools since the Burgundy team is not the main team of the school. It would analogous to a varsity team scheduling a JV squad, albeit probably a very good JV squad. Again, as I have been out of the coaching/scheduling loop a long time, I may be mistaken about this.

 

[ravemwp]

do more for the community!? what more do you expect? The team has successfully brought national attention to the area, included local schools in the BKIS, created jobs, revenue for the city, all while helping to keep the doors of the school open. yet, their burgundy team still cant get a local game within the county "because they aren't local kids". last time i checked, Pallotti doesn't play with "local kids" either. Its the same bullshit IMO that has existed for years-well before BW had the program is does today. I don't think they should be required to "show up" to a tournament when the burgundy team can't even get on the schedule. would it be nice to show support for the other programs? sure! but come on, give the burgundy kids some games!

First thing is you totally misread the meaning of my post. Secondly I never said anything about doing more for the community. Thirdly I always want my Alma Mater to be better than the rest. Bishop Walsh has always played second fiddle to Allegany, and Fort Hill in Cumberland area sports, since my childhood in the 70s. That is not an opinion, that is fact. FH, and Alco has brought so much positive attention to the region with so many state championships in multiple sports. Now that BW has a chance to bring some basketball attention to the area, some people got butt hurt. My post was meant more to promote Cumberland basketball as a whole, to repair some of the wounds created by the BW decision to take their program to a different level. It's no secret that the Alco, and FH communities became angry when they felt BW poached Mikey and Chazz from their respective programs. My question becomes, how and when do we fix what is broken. How do we make Cumberland basketball embraced by the whole community. I was suggesting that it takes effort from all three city schools. I would be proud that my Alma Mater was prominently involved in extending the olive branch so to speak. I just felt that BW missed an opportunity to help heal some old wounds, by showing some sort of presence at this local event. Reciprocating some of the support shown at the BKIS. This is not a bash BW post. It's a let the healing process begin post. In the 70s, when Bob Kirk decided to take ACC to the national level he needed the support, and backing of the community. He worked very hard, and always had a presence at local high school events, even though his teams were made up of out of towners. His players would be seen at high school games. He had a vision that needed the support of the community. So Coach Kirk embraced the community, and the community embraced him right back. I didn't mean to get your feathers ruffled, it was not my intent. I want the whole community to embrace the BW vision. It will take lots of work on their part, so any opportunity to engraciate yourself to the community not taken is a missed opportunity for gathering a few more supporters. I hope this clarifies my original post. BTW, if I understand correctly BW Burgundy will be playing FH JV or Freshman team. It may not be ideal, but it's a start.

 

[ravemwp]

I may be wrong on this, but I don’t think that scheduling BW’s Burgundy team would count as a game for state playoff points for Maryland public schools since the Burgundy team is not the main team of the school. It would analogous to a varsity team scheduling a JV squad, albeit probably a very good JV squad. Again, as I have been out of the coaching/scheduling loop a long time, I may be mistaken about this.

I think in the coming years the Burgundy team will be playing more local games. Probably at the JV level. I'm not positive about the repercussions of varsity games. FH has them on their freshman or JV schedule this year. Allegany will never schedule them until a certain bittermen leaves. I just hope BW can sustain its program and get more regional support.

 

[TDHelmick]

BW has been in a fight for survival. Literally to stay open in a tiny diminished rural town. They drastically did what they had to do to survive. Allegany and FH will do the same in athletics with their participation levels being what they are. When BW started this national basketball deal they originally took the best players coming out of the local city middle schools. The names are well documented. OK Fine, but you can't complain when the drastic reaction becomes we are not playing BW any more. Which is what happened that first year and still lingers.

If it ever started with football, being more a football person, I will go out of my way to stem it, no matter what drastic measure is required. It's called once again, a fight for survival. Take 5 of the best players off of Allegany and they possibly fold the program.

So I have come to the conclusion that BW owes the city schools nothing. The city schools owe BW nothing. It's every school for themselves at this point. It's a fight for survival and no option is off the table. That's the world we live in. I don't see a reconciliation ever happening unless BW, Allegany and FH become one school.

 

[SS610]

How is a 1-6 record garnering national attention? It's a good thing they play that nationally ranked Keyser Golden Tornado. This game might me their only win in 2023.

 

[cumbfanatic]

I didn’t see Keyser on the schedule. Morgantown isn’t on the schedule after the loss last year.

 

[SS610]

I didn’t see Keyser on the schedule. Morgantown isn’t on the schedule after the loss last year.

My bad, it wasn't Keyser but Hyndman Area.

 

[bigdawgrefwmd]

I Graduated at Walsh but can't see why BW people would worry about supporting Alco or FH or why either of them would worry about Supporting BW
I mean seriously none of them are from here so why would anyone care?
I would go watch if there is a big game but just to watch and really could care less who wins...
The Public Schools in Maryland can not play Their Burgundy team as the games would not be counted for anything as they aren't a REAL Team and it wouldn't benefit them in any way.
Back in the day when Alco refused to play them because of a transfer or two from the local schools was dumb to me but now as a Public school I wouldn't help them in any way, I wouldn't play them in any sport boys or girls..
I still have yet to figure out the actual purpose of this team, they aren't beating any of the schools they are playing on the National level and even if they ever do Win, why would anyone in Cumberland other than BW people care?

 

[Bleedred4life]

The State will recognize the Burgundy team as being a JV team, much like St Francis in football. If you've seen them in the quad, you know that they could play against most any Maryland publics and come out with a win. In Maryland everyone makes the playoffs as long as they have the required number of games. (At least that has been the rule in the past.) In Western Maryland, the land of snow and ice, the teams don't always get their scheduled games in, as a coach, do you really want to take a chance and play against a team that doesn't count?

When BW first started on this path, it was an attempt to save the school. They stated that they would not draw from the local talent. That didn't last long, so the schools basically turned their backs because BW started recruiting locally from the get-go. It was a huge mistake on their part. At first, I said that Fort Hill should schedule practices and scrimmages with their varsity team as much as possible. I looked at it as an opportunity to improve Fort Hill basketball. (Playing them two games a year really doesn't help much) With all ties cut off, that isn't going to happen.

Bottom line, BW needs the Basketball team to make money. Their staff is probably the lowest paid in the State, and they have less than 400 kids in grades K-12. That's less than 30 kids in each grade. Tack on the burden of an upcoming court battle concerning an overdose in one of their dorms last year, the school is hanging by a thread. I have no ties to BW so I don't even have a dog in this fight, but I hate to see Cumberland loose anything. Even if it's only a Private school.

 

[TDHelmick]

The State will recognize the Burgundy team as being a JV team, much like St Francis in football. If you've seen them in the quad, you know that they could play against most any Maryland publics and come out with a win. In Maryland everyone makes the playoffs as long as they have the required number of games. (At least that has been the rule in the past.) In Western Maryland, the land of snow and ice, the teams don't always get their scheduled games in, as a coach, do you really want to take a chance and play against a team that doesn't count?

When BW first started on this path, it was an attempt to save the school. They stated that they would not draw from the local talent. That didn't last long, so the schools basically turned their backs because BW started recruiting locally from the get-go. It was a huge mistake on their part. At first, I said that Fort Hill should schedule practices and scrimmages with their varsity team as much as possible. I looked at it as an opportunity to improve Fort Hill basketball. (Playing them two games a year really doesn't help much) With all ties cut off, that isn't going to happen.

Bottom line, BW needs the Basketball team to make money. Their staff is probably the lowest paid in the State, and they have less than 400 kids in grades K-12. That's less than 30 kids in each grade. Tack on the burden of an upcoming court battle concerning an overdose in one of their dorms last year, the school is hanging by a thread. I have no ties to BW so I don't even have a dog in this fight, but I hate to see Cumberland loose anything. Even if it's only a Private school.

So the BW player that died in the dorm last year...I never did hear how he died. Not that it's anyone's business outside of his family and BW but things like that are usually not kept under the hat so well. The Len Bias tragedy had every coach fired and an entire university crushed on several levels and Bias was 22 years old. I was not aware of a pending law suit.

Regardless of the reason...when a parent/guardian sends a 14-16 year old off to a private sports academy 200-500 miles away, who is looking after these kids? Especially in today's legal world of liability. If the BW student-athlete died of an overdose that's not gonna be good.

In the time of my mother...when they lived in a college dorm there was someone called a house mom in every dorm. They lived there and enforced rules and that was college. We are talking about young teenagers now. Wow, I don't get this world any more.

 

[ravemwp]

The State will recognize the Burgundy team as being a JV team, much like St Francis in football. If you've seen them in the quad, you know that they could play against most any Maryland publics and come out with a win. In Maryland everyone makes the playoffs as long as they have the required number of games. (At least that has been the rule in the past.) In Western Maryland, the land of snow and ice, the teams don't always get their scheduled games in, as a coach, do you really want to take a chance and play against a team that doesn't count?

When BW first started on this path, it was an attempt to save the school. They stated that they would not draw from the local talent. That didn't last long, so the schools basically turned their backs because BW started recruiting locally from the get-go. It was a huge mistake on their part. At first, I said that Fort Hill should schedule practices and scrimmages with their varsity team as much as possible. I looked at it as an opportunity to improve Fort Hill basketball. (Playing them two games a year really doesn't help much) With all ties cut off, that isn't going to happen.

Bottom line, BW needs the Basketball team to make money. Their staff is probably the lowest paid in the State, and they have less than 400 kids in grades K-12. That's less than 30 kids in each grade. Tack on the burden of an upcoming court battle concerning an overdose in one of their dorms last year, the school is hanging by a thread. I have no ties to BW so I don't even have a dog in this fight, but I hate to see Cumberland loose anything. Even if it's only a Private school.

Very well stated. You are correct In saying that BW needed to take this route to keep the school open. It was also my understanding that BW would not try to recruit local players. That being said, it is also my understanding that 2 of the early players in question( most know who they are) parents approached BW about their kids playing for BW. Walsh made no promises, but also said they wouldn't turn them away. An adult decision that really pissed off other adults, and school administrators in the county. Yet a decision that was made at the bequest of the parents trying to give their children the best opportunity available. My original post wasn't to find or place blame, my intent is to mend the fences. Of course it doesn't make sense for the teams to play against each other, but as you said to scrimmage, and or practice, and have some workouts together would only be beneficial to the local kids. I'm sure the kids would be excited, any athlete worth his salt loves and are open to the challenge of better competition. Like you said certain adults in the room will keep those doors closed. BTW Fort Hill freshman are scheduled to play BW Burgundy twice this season. Just for shits and giggles, give me Allen, Fields, and Imes in the backcourt Seifarth, and Chorpenning in the front court, Burns, Miller, and Uma off the bench and a week of practice. Then challenge BW Elite to an old fashioned playground pickup type game. These guys would hold their own against this year BW team. Oh well if we could all just coexist. I didn't know that there was a pending lawsuit against BW, never knew they publicly disclosed the cause of death.

 

[cumbfanatic]

I also thought the 2 players attended BW for better opportunity. I did not think BW went chasing after the 2 players

 

[Bleedred4life]

If that's what happened, good for BW. Parents should be able to pick and choose where their child will go.

Now one note on Ravemwp's all-star game. I really like it for the end of season. It may even be a good fund raiser, not to mention open up some doors that have been slammed shut lately.

 

[ravemwp]

If that's what happened, good for BW. Parents should be able to pick and choose where their child will go.

Now one note on Ravemwp's all-star game. I really like it for the end of season. It may even be a good fund raiser, not to mention open up some doors that have been slammed shut lately.

If you had a person with enough clout, and connections that could convince a certain entitled bittermen holding an unwarranted grudge. It might just be enjoyable and beneficial to everyone. Oh well.

 

[TDHelmick]

If you had a person with enough clout, and connections that could convince a certain entitled bittermen holding an unwarranted grudge. It might just be enjoyable and beneficial to everyone. Oh well.

I'm not sure why anyone at BW or another city school would want to see each other play on the basketball court. Not the Varsity or Burgundy team. I don't support it. BW wanted a national program and they got it. Be happy and forget local competition.

I said the same in the mid-90s when BW refused to play the other city teams in football for 15+ years. Using hindsight why would anyone want to make it happen? And that's when BW was using local kids for football.

 

[ravemwp]

I'm not sure why anyone at BW or another city school would want to see each other play on the basketball court. Not the Varsity or Burgundy team. I don't support it. BW wanted a national program and they got it. Be happy and forget local competition.

I said the same in the mid-90s when BW refused to play the other city teams in football for 15+ years. Using hindsight why would anyone want to make it happen? And that's when BW was using local kids for football.

It wasn't meant as a suggestion. If you read my original statement I never said it should happen. I said for shits and giggles, I could take some of the local kids from the county schools, and hold their own against this years BW Elite team playing on the playground. Never suggested it should happen. Someone else thought it could possibly be a fund raising event. (Which I dont necessarily disagree with). While I believe certain adults in this county would never support or allow this to happen, I do believe the student athletes on both sides would welcome the challenge. It was just an off the cuff thought while conversing on local high school basketball.

 

[cumbfanatic]

I think a local all star team playing against the BW team would be good to raise money. Also, some of the BW players will go on to play D1 basketball so it could be a good experience for local players.

 

[Bleedred4life]

As much as I feel that I would enjoy the game, I also feel that it would be next to impossible to pull off. It couldn't be during the school year as most sports run back to back and, in the public schools, most kids play different sports if they can play. Small schools have this problem. Then you have the summer, but there are leagues and I'm guessing that most of BW's kids are in those leagues or at home with their parents. Lastly, how are the profits going to be divided? That in it's self would be a nightmare. It's just too bad that the kids can't get together and say "our team will play yours at the Post playground on Saturday at noon". I guess I'm dating myself now. LOL

 

[ravemwp]

As much as I feel that I would enjoy the game, I also feel that it would be next to impossible to pull off. It couldn't be during the school year as most sports run back to back and, in the public schools, most kids play different sports if they can play. Small schools have this problem. Then you have the summer, but there are leagues and I'm guessing that most of BW's kids are in those leagues or at home with their parents. Lastly, how are the profits going to be divided? That in it's self would be a nightmare. It's just too bad that the kids can't get together and say "our team will play yours at the Post playground on Saturday at noon". I guess I'm dating myself now. LOL

My go to was Columbia St., and West Side playgrounds in the mid to late 70s. LOL. Really dating myself. Lots of street talent in those days.

 

[PowerRamRight]

Hey Bleedred - how about I join you in dating oneself. Maybe those players can play on teams against each other in the Gold Medal Tournament? That's the way it was once done.

 

[ravemwp]

Hey Bleedred - how about I join you in dating oneself. Maybe those players can play on teams against each other in the Gold Medal Tournament? That's the way it was once done.

Holy crap, wasn't that a tournament that used weight as an eligibility factor. I played in that tournament at the old YMCA in 1972. I couldn't eat the day of our first game so I could make weight.(under 95 pounds) I was older but lighter, 14 years old playing with and against a bunch of 12 year olds. Damn you guys just took me way back down memory lane.

 

[TDHelmick]

I'm still working on bringing back The Oldtimers Football Game - LOL
Mike Hast is still my noseguard.

 

[ravemwp]

I'm still working on bringing back The Oldtimers Football Game - LOL
Mike Hast is still my noseguard.

Played against Mike. Saw him not long ago. That crazy bastard would still play. LMAO

 

[PowerRamRight]

Hey Rave...given your weight comment and going to BW, you must have played in the old Catholic Youth Football League which had no weight limit vs. the CAYFL's 135 pound limit at the time....more memories.

 

[ravemwp]

Yes I did, but we did have a weight restriction that if you weighed over 135, you had to play on the interior line, both ways. You were not able to carry, catch, or throw the football. They even had scales at the field on each game day to challenge questionable players. They took that rule very seriously.