The weight room spread offense

[TDHelmick]

Cambridge head coach Toby Peer had this to say after his team lost their semifinal game at Greenway, "If any team is going to come into Fort Hill and win, you have to first win the weight room."

He was half right.

With some expansion on that notion, if any team is going to come into Fort Hill and win, you have to first dump the spread offense mentality. I said mentality. The spread is not a physical approach to football. Quite the opposite. Five receivers, shotgun every snap, not enough blockers on the line, no blocking backs, running the ball based on open space with ball carriers seven yards deep. Forget it!

The only offense in Maryland that dedicates this much importance to coaching running backs to block is Cumberland. The process has little to do with a weight room.

The weight room doesn't offer much offensively when the alignments and play calls are strictly based on skill and speed. There is no power game in the spread. That aspect is so far removed today we are literally seeing teams in shotgun on 4th and goal at the half inch line trying to power the ball against a goal line defense.

You're not going to see NFL teams running 100% spread. The physicality and strength of players will crush it. What is even more astounding about the spread is that most all teams using it have no clue how to line up under center. Why?

Watch the Fort Hill offense. Despite being a wing-T offense under center they spent a good 10-15 snaps in shotgun against Cambridge. Is it so hard to teach a quarterback and center to do both? Even the Josh Allen and Dak Prescott signal callers of the world have to also go under center to run the dad gum ball.

If you watched every single FH game this year, the only opponent who did not run shotgun spread was Northern -- Week One. By season's end they were spread too. Not sure what it is when 95% of all high school coaches feel this need to keep up with the Joneses by running what everyone else does religiously.

All these FH opponents do nothing but practice the spread, run the spread and defend the spread because everybody runs the spread. The closer you get to the metro areas the worse it gets. None of these teams know physical football, want physical football or like physical football. It's all parallel to the wussification of football whether it be due to safety concerns or a "feelings hurt" mentality or my kid can't get to college running and blocking.

No, I'm not saying the weight room doesn't matter. As mentioned already, Coach Peer is half right. Oh, it matters.

The weight room will only carry a team so far in this soft spread world mentality. When I hear any person, football educated or not, mention things such as Fort Hill needs to evolve and do what everyone else does by running the spread, I cringe while understanding that person knows very little about football. What also gets lost in such a statement is that FH does run the shotgun spread more than occasionally. They have just been coached to do it while also lining up under center and ramming the ball down your throat. Why other teams stick to being one deminsional shotgun is their own shortcoming both mentally and on the scoreboard.

Smashmouth football is a rarity. Not here nor at Navy - Marine Corps Stadium first week of December.

 

[ravemwp]

Cambridge head coach Toby Peer had this to say after his team lost their semifinal game at Greenway, "If any team is going to come into Fort Hill and win, you have to first win the weight room."

He was half right.

With some expansion on that notion, if any team is going to come into Fort Hill and win, you have to first dump the spread offense mentality. I said mentality. The spread is not a physical approach to football. Quite the opposite. Five receivers, shotgun every snap, not enough blockers on the line, no blocking backs, running the ball based on open space with ball carriers seven yards deep. Forget it!

The only offense in Maryland that dedicates this much time to coaching running backs to block is Cumberland. The process has little to do with a weight room.

The weight room doesn't offer much offensively when the alignments and play calls are strictly based on skill and speed. There is no power game in the spread. That aspect is so far removed today we are literally seeing teams in shotgun on 4th and goal at the half inch line trying to power the ball against a goal line defense.

You're not going to see NFL teams running 100% spread. The physicality and strength of players will crush it. What is even more astounding about the spread is that most all teams using it have no clue how to line up under center. Why?

Watch the Fort Hill offense. Despite being a wing-T offense under center they spent a good 10-15 snaps in shotgun against Cambridge. Is it so hard to teach a quarterback and center to do both? Even the Josh Allen and Dak Prescott signal callers of the world have to also go under center to run the dad gum ball.

If you watched every single FH game this year, the only opponent who did not run shotgun spread was Northern. Not sure what it is when 95% of all high school coaches feel this need to keep up with the Joneses by running what everyone else does religiously.

All these FH opponents do nothing but practice the spread, run the spread and defend the spread because everybody runs the spread. The closer you get to the metro areas the worse it gets. None of these teams know physical football, want physical football or like physical football. It's all parallel to the wussification of football whether it be due to safety concerns or a "feelings hurt" mentality.

The weight room will only carry a team so far in this soft spread world mentality. When I hear any person, football educated or not, mention things such as Fort Hill needs to evolve and do what everyone else does by running the spread, I cringe while understanding that person knows very little about football. What also gets lost in such a statement is that FH does run the shotgun spread more than occasionally. They have just been coached to do it while also lining up under center and ramming the ball down your throat. Why other teams stick to being one deminsional shotgun is their own shortcoming both mentally and on the scoreboard.

Smashmouth football is a rarity. Not here nor at Navy - Marine Corps Stadium first week of December.

I for one 100 percent agree with all aspects of your observations. I do think Coach Peer statement about the weight room was a metaphor pertaining to the physicality of which FH plays, more so than their brute strength. When you come to play FH you don't just get punched in the mouth, you get continuously punched in the mouth. What's that old saying. " Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the face ".

 

[TDHelmick]

I for one 100 percent agree with all aspects of your observations. I do think Coach Peer statement about the weight room was a metaphor pertaining to the physicality of which FH plays, more so than their brute strength. When you come to play FH you don't just get punched in the mouth, you get continuously punched in the mouth. What's that old saying. " Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the face ".

I did say Coach Peer was half right

Certainly weight room matters. More so when used on the field.

 

[Waggle Pass]

I know most FH fans gave Coach Shook a lot of flack (including yours truly) in the past, but a real tip of the cap to him this year. I was never a fan of the spread, but I do like FH giving teams more to prepare for this year.

 

[ravemwp]

I know most FH fans gave Coach Shook a lot of flack (including yours truly) in the past, but a real tip of the cap to him this year. I was never a fan of the spread, but I do like FH giving teams more to prepare for this year.

I really like how they tinkered with their base offense to become more multiple, and put their kids in a better position to succeed. Giving them certain packages that play to some of the kids different skill sets. I got a chuckle out of the announcers on the Commercial Video Broadcast. After the long Tristan Ross touchdown got called back one of them said Ross may be the fastest kid on the team. To which I muttered to myself " dude he may be the fastest kid in three counties, (Allegany, Washington, Garrett ) and this coaching staff is finding ways to exploit that speed." Great coaching philosophies. Use what works best for this team this week without getting to far away from your basic principles.

 

[PowerRamRight]

I for one 100 percent agree with all aspects of your observations. I do think Coach Peer statement about the weight room was a metaphor pertaining to the physicality of which FH plays, more so than their brute strength. When you come to play FH you don't just get punched in the mouth, you get continuously punched in the mouth. What's that old saying. " Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the face ".

I think the coach was also talking to his own players, staff and community for the future. In a way a "call to arms." Interesting to see what happens there in the off-season.

 

[otnorot]

The Stone Bridge coach, who ran a single wing with no receivers in sight for years, had some comments earlier this season about having to work in some spread in recent times to avoid losing talented players (probably one factor why metro-area schools are more likely to shift to trendier offenses), and where he thinks the prevalence of 7 on 7 and flag is leading football. Runs from about 17:00 to 22:30 here:

 

[zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz]

Martinsburg’s spread offense would bully Fort Hill’s D and their single wing offense wouldn’t get any going against Martinsburg’s D

 

[Waggle Pass]

Martinsburg’s spread offense would bully Fort Hill’s D and their single wing offense wouldn’t get any going against Martinsburg’s D

Fort Hill doesn't run a single wing offense.

 

[K7w5]

I definitely don’t agree that you can’t be physical running the spread. The spread is a bit nebulous as a concept, but don’t see how you can say teams like Hurts’ Alabama and Oklahoma, Tebow’s Florida, or Newton’s Auburn weren’t physical.

At the HS level there are a great number of physically dominating spread teams.

You definitely are right when it comes to many coaches not understanding how to coach the game when they’re taken from their comfort zone(ie running to numbers and defending basic 11p and 10p sets), but many exceptions to that. Even in metro areas.

 

[cognizantbutconcussed]

Martinsburg’s spread offense would bully Fort Hill’s D and their single wing offense wouldn’t get any going against Martinsburg’s D

Good contribution from under the N. Queen Street bridge. I didn't watch this week, but I did watch the bulldogs vs Jefferson. I saw a lot of people walking around, not staying with blocks, and frankly laziness. They're a great program and results don't lie. But with most of the panhandle ballers choosing to go to Martinsburg for football before the transfer portal was official in WV, I was less than impressed by their performance during that game. On that night, against this team, I'd respectfully disagree. But we'll never know, unless you can organize an unsanctioned game in a few weeks. I'd attend

 

[FHHSAHS]

Martinsburg’s spread offense would bully Fort Hill’s D and their single wing offense wouldn’t get any going against Martinsburg’s D

The last two times that spread offense played FH the Dawgs went 1-1.

 

[Waggle Pass]

Why don't panhandle people talk about Martinsburg challenging themselves with school's of their own size. The Quince Orchards, Wises or the Baltimore or DC privates?

 

[K7w5]

Why don't panhandle people talk about Martinsburg challenging themselves with school's of their own size. The Quince Orchards, Wises or the Baltimore or DC privates?

Martinsburg put a running clock on Stone Bridge, who then played QO down to the final seconds a couple weeks later earlier in the season. Also split with Highland Springs(probably best overall program in VA), Riverside Ohio(top 10 D2 team), dominated their series with Salem Va(elite 4A program), and handled a very talented Clarkson North out of Canada. And that’s just in recent years.

Not easy to schedule anyone out of MD with the 9 game regular season and staggered start dates. Martinsburg was going to schedule Wise a few years back, but Wise refused to take a return trip. So Highland Springs was put on instead. I do look for a QO or Flowers series to happen in the next few years.

Martinsburg-FH gets talked about for obvious reasons. But the idea that martinsburg is reluctant to schedule big time opponents is just laughable.

 

[Waggle Pass]

Martinsburg put a running clock on Stone Bridge, who then played QO down to the final seconds a couple weeks later earlier in the season. Also split with Highland Springs(probably best overall program in VA), Riverside Ohio(top 10 D2 team), dominated their series with Salem Va(elite 4A program), and handled a very talented Clarkson North out of Canada. And that’s just in recent years.

Not easy to schedule anyone out of MD with the 9 game regular season and staggered start dates. Martinsburg was going to schedule Wise a few years back, but Wise refused to take a return trip. So Highland Springs was put on instead. I do look for a QO or Flowers series to happen in the next few years.

Martinsburg-FH gets talked about for obvious reasons. But the idea that martinsburg is reluctant to schedule big time opponents is just laughable.

Didn't mean to suggest that Martinsburg was reluctant to schedule larger schools, but few in their fanbase (at least from what I have seen) mention any Maryland school other than Fort Hill.

 

[TDHelmick]

Over they years I have grown tiresome of the Martinsburg discussion. Truth is, it's not really Martinsburg fans that bring up the subject. It's usually local people who just get sick of FH winning or a response as to why Frankfort and Keyser won't play FH. Sometimes it might be some of the older FH crowd that remembers what life was like in Cumberland 40-60 years ago. They remember 6,000 people in the stands not the 500 people in that stands we currently have for a state semifinal game and highly ranked teams from Ohio. I have several replies to the old "why don't you schedule Martinsburg" and I have documented those replies publicly for a long time. My usual response is, why doesn't any other WV school schedule Fort Hill? It doesn't matter anymore.

But for the record in response to Martinsburg being reluctant to schedule larger competition, the Bulldogs absolutely want no part of the DC area private schools. Despite the fact more than a third of the Martinsburg population commutes daily to those areas for work. It's only a 75 to 90 minute drive. I'm not pointing fingers because I don't wish to play Martinsburg if they are the only team in that state that will play FH. If we could get the EPAC to give FH a small slate of games then I believe FH would play Martinsburg every year.

 

[Tony54]

Martinsburg’s spread offense would bully Fort Hill’s D and their single wing offense wouldn’t get any going against Martinsburg’s D

Get some sleep. Your obviously delusional

 

[K7w5]

Didn't mean to suggest that Martinsburg was reluctant to schedule larger schools, but few in their fanbase (at least from what I have seen) mention any Maryland school other than Fort Hill.

I think fort hill is the only Maryland school people in WV really care about to be honest. There is just so little history with most schools in Maryland being newer and so few out of state games being scheduled.

Over they years I have grown tiresome of the Martinsburg discussion. Truth is, it's not really Martinsburg fans that bring up the subject. It's usually local people who just get sick of FH winning or a response as to why Frankfort and Keyser won't play FH. Sometimes it might be some of the older FH crowd that remembers what life was like in Cumberland 40-60 years ago. They remember 6,000 people in the stands not the 500 people in that stands we currently have for a state semifinal game and highly ranked teams from Ohio. I have several replies to the old "why don't you schedule Martinsburg" and I have documented those replies publicly for a long time. My usual response is, why doesn't any other WV school schedule Fort Hill? It doesn't matter anymore.

But for the record in response to Martinsburg being reluctant to schedule larger competition, the Bulldogs absolutely want no part of the DC area private schools. Despite the fact more than a third of the Martinsburg population commutes daily to those areas for work. It's only a 75 to 90 minute drive. I'm not pointing fingers because I don't wish to play Martinsburg if they are the only team in that state that will play FH. If we could get the EPAC to give FH a small slate of games then I believe FH would play Martinsburg every year.

Public vs Private is a different ball game. When you’re openly recruiting kids, all your kids go one way. It’s different. Especially when we’re talking about WCAC. Martinsburg would compete fine with most MIAA programs. It takes a special group of kids at even elite public school programs to compete with Dematha or GC. 6A Freedom in VA has a group like that now. Martinsburg had one like that in 2019, and would’ve had another this year if not for losing several pieces to the “transfer portal” over the years.

Juice isn’t worth the squeeze regardless however. Most privates are small enrollment and/or play a schedule full of other small enrollment private schools. The WV points system makes no accommodation for this and punishes “big school” programs like Martinsburg for playing “small school” programs. If martinsburg played and beat St Francis or Good Counsel, it would count roughly the same as beating Hancock.

 

[zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz]

Get some sleep. Your obviously delusional

You must not have watched their semifinal game against Huntington or any of their games this season for that matter. Rusher for 380 and held the Highlanders to just 22 on the ground. Only 1 team rushed for over 100 yards against them which was Football North.

 

[TDHelmick]

I think fort hill is the only Maryland school people in WV really care about to be honest. There is just so little history with most schools in Maryland being newer and so few out of state games being scheduled.


Public vs Private is a different ball game. When you’re openly recruiting kids, all your kids go one way. It’s different. Especially when we’re talking about WCAC. Martinsburg would compete fine with most MIAA programs. It takes a special group of kids at even elite public school programs to compete with Dematha or GC. 6A Freedom in VA has a group like that now. Martinsburg had one like that in 2019, and would’ve had another this year if not for losing several pieces to the “transfer portal” over the years.

Juice isn’t worth the squeeze regardless however. Most privates are small enrollment and/or play a schedule full of other small enrollment private schools. The WV points system makes no accommodation for this and punishes “big school” programs like Martinsburg for playing “small school” programs. If martinsburg played and beat St Francis or Good Counsel, it would count roughly the same as beating Hancock.

Everything in this discussion is a different ball game for each school. Public/Private, Enrollment Size, Transfer Protocols, Location, etc. What isn't good for Martinsburg vs. WCAC teams is not likely good for FH playing teams like Martinsburg. If you are going to use an analogy such as beating St. Frances or Good Counsel being the same as beating Hancock when it comes to points, that applies to small school Fort Hill as well. But as I mentioned, I rarely hear Martinsburg people talking about playing FH unless they grew up in Cumberland long ago.

If we really wanted to discuss recruiting or the transfer portal in this private vs. public domain, for certain the higher end private schools do much more in terms of active recruiting. However, it is well documented through the past decade plus that Martinsburg is pulling from the entire panhandle when it comes to talent. At least that is what all the EPAC coaches tell me year in and year out. When I set up the CAYFL non-league schedules for 2023 against the Martinsburg middle school league teams, every coach told me their best players would attend Martinsburg High School. After the local youth league Patriots team beat the Martinsburg middle school team 50-0 by halftime I had a long conversation with their league commissioner. He's like, that won't be the same team once these middle schoolers get to high school. The same comes from the Jefferson County coaches I talk with. It is out of control according to all the opposing coaches in that region and has been for a long time. It's no secret Martinsburg pulls the best talent out of the panhandle to play football. Am I pointing fingers? No, the girls are just prettier in Orange & Black I suppose, LOL.

The transfer portal is the nature of the beast today at every level. Martinsburg has been good at it long before a portal came into existence. Kudos to them. I would not be surprised if it starts getting to a larger scale at Fort Hill. But this area has far less population. If FH were located in more populated areas like even Hagerstown or Baltimore, it would be more prevalent. These teams like Dunbar and Martinsburg don't have to actively recruit. Kids just transfer to these places on their own because they win and public schools have no tuition.

 

[cognizantbutconcussed]

Everything in this discussion is a different ball game for each school. Public/Private, Enrollment Size, Transfer Protocols, Location, etc. What isn't good for Martinsburg vs. WCAC teams is not likely good for FH playing teams like Martinsburg. If you are going to use an analogy such as beating St. Frances or Good Counsel being the same as beating Hancock when it comes to points, that applies to small school Fort Hill as well. But as I mentioned, I rarely hear Martinsburg people talking about playing FH unless they grew up in Cumberland long ago.

If we really wanted to discuss recruiting or the transfer portal in this private vs. public domain, for certain the higher end private schools do much more in terms of active recruiting. However, it is well documented through the past decade plus that Martinsburg is pulling from the entire panhandle when it comes to talent. At least that is what all the EPAC coaches tell me year in and year out. When I set up the CAYFL non-league schedules for 2023 against the Martinsburg middle school league teams, every coach told me their best players would attend Martinsburg High School. The same comes from the Jefferson County coaches I talk with. It is out of control according to all the opposing coaches in that region and has been for a long time. It's no secret Martinsburg pulls the best talent out of the panhandle to play football. Am I pointing fingers? No, the girls are just prettier in Orange & Black I suppose, LOL.

The transfer portal is the nature of the beast today at every level. Martinsburg has been good at it long before a portal came into existence. Kudos to them. I would not be surprised if it starts getting to a larger scale at Fort Hill. But this area has far less population. If FH were located in more populated areas like even Hagerstown or Baltimore, it would be more prevalent. These teams like Dunbar and Martinsburg don't have to actively recruit. Kids just transfer to these places on their own because they win.

Correct. 100% unapologetically documented. I typically don't name names but he Bagent family has such a social media and online presence, they don't hide the fact they live in Shepherdstown. 1 of Tyson's early videos actually discusses him deciding between Washington in Charlestown bc of basketball or Martinsburg to focus on football. It's real, it has been real, and they don't really hide it....and with a transfer portal now existing in Dub V, they don't have to.
There's a reason WVU commit departed Huntington for Cabell Midland....Hurricane picked up multiple South Charleston players before the season and then beat them 89-7.
In a world of showcases, Prospect camps, NIL $$$, travel ball, programs with proven success, etc...this is what you'll have. The days of spending 2 hours an evening for 5 days ( 1 week during your summer vacation) at a Potomac State football camp and thinking you just put some work in and added to your resume....They're gone with the wind. Camps, championships, travel ball, whatever....it's all about stacking the deck and money. A lot of resources go in to creating dynasties and that's what serious families want to "say" they're part of. Rec ball basically non-existent and likely won't be soon, or just limited to young kids so parents can figure out if they're travel ball worthy or need to find something else to do. Sorry, tangent, soap box. Done

 

[TDHelmick]

Correct. 100% unapologetically documented. I typically don't name names but he Bagent family has such a social media and online presence, they don't hide the fact they live in Shepherdstown. 1 of Tyson's early videos actually discusses him deciding between Washington in Charlestown bc of basketball or Martinsburg to focus on football. It's real, it has been real, and they don't really hide it....and with a transfer portal now existing in Dub V, they don't have to.
There's a reason WVU commit departed Huntington for Cabell Midland....Hurricane picked up multiple South Charleston players before the season and then beat them 89-7.
In a world of showcases, Prospect camps, NIL $$$, travel ball, programs with proven success, etc...this is what you'll have. The days of spending 2 hours an evening for 5 days ( 1 week during your summer vacation) at a Potomac State football camp and thinking you just put some work in and added to your resume....They're gone with the wind. Camps, championships, travel ball, whatever....it's all about stacking the deck and money. A lot of resources go in to creating dynasties and that's what serious families want to "say" they're part of. Rec ball basically non-existent and likely won't be soon, or just limited to young kids so parents can figure out if they're travel ball worthy or need to find something else to do. Sorry, tangent, soap box. Done

I could not have said that better. I'm not looking forward to what NIL means at the high school level.

 

[Argox66]

I could not have said that better. I'm not looking forward to what NIL means at the high school level.

I consider the NIL a blight on the integrity of the game at the collegiate level