How bad 1A Football has gotten in MD?

[beall02]

I know that in other posts some have mentioned on here just how bad 1A Football is in Maryland. Has it got to historic proportions though? A whopping 33% (4 of 12) teams in other regions that would currently qualify for the playoffs today are under .500. I understand if we were just three weeks into the season but we have three weeks left in the season.

In looking at those regions I have to say that when people say that the 1A Championship will be decided in the 1A West Region Championship game I would love to disagree with that but honestly... I don't see a reason to doubt that one bit.

With Joppatowne, Catoctin, Dunbar and some others including Mountain Ridge moving up to AA in recent years it has really left nothing in A. And before anyone says anything, I know MR has not had a winning season in three years, but they were in playoff contention pretty much every year before that.

Fort Hill has a chance to do something special over the next few years. Obviously that is if they can beat their City rival like they have in the past couple years come playoff time.

 

[cumbfanatic]

1A is what it is. It has for the most part always been decided in the West. Use to be
Allegany now it's FH. The reason being not because 1A is so weak it's because they have 2 of the best programs from youth league all the way up in the state.

 

[beall02]

From 2002 to 2012, only once did the West Region Champion win the title, that was Allegany in 2005. 9 out of 10 years someone other than the West winning it I would not consider always being the West. Granted, 7 of those 9 were Dunbar. 1992 to 2002 only had 3 and two of those were in the first three years when Boonsboro and Smithsburg won it back-to-back. That means only 4 times in the last 20 years has it been a team from the West.

 

[beall02]

1A is what it is. It has for the most part always been decided in the West. Use to be
Allegany now it's FH. The reason being not because 1A is so weak it's because they have 2 of the best programs from youth league all the way up in the state.

The one thing that I will agree with you here is the fact that Alco and Fort Hill does it right from Youth League all the way up.

 

[beall02]

From 2002 to 2012, only once did the West Region Champion win the title, that was Allegany in 2005. 9 out of 10 years someone other than the West winning it I would not consider always being the West. Granted, 7 of those 9 were Dunbar. 1992 to 2002 only had 3 and two of those were in the first three years when Boonsboro and Smithsburg won it back-to-back. That means only 4 times in the last 20 years has it been a team from the West.

This is obviously not including Fort Hill's back-to-back titles in the past two years. From 1992 to 2012 is time frame I was referring to.

 

[alco65]

I wouldn't say Alco does it right from youth league up. Until just a couple of years ago there was no consistency at Braddock. The staff that was there before the current staff was absolutely horrible. The Patriots have had the same head coach for years. With all this being said pretty sure Allegany has absolutely nothing to do with the Braddock team. The only connection now is Geno being on Alco staff and I believe the head coach of D1

 

[Bubbahead70]

I wouldn't say Alco does it right from youth league up. Until just a couple of years ago there was no consistency at Braddock. The staff that was there before the current staff was absolutely horrible. The Patriots have had the same head coach for years. With all this being said pretty sure Allegany has absolutely nothing to do with the Braddock team. The only connection now is Geno being on Alco staff and I believe the head coach of D1

Its sad too. There are some good young kids that play for Allegany's feeder teams. The only time there is ever a connection between those kids and Alco football is if those kids go to Allegany's football camp.

 

[BoyznBlue]

Cumberland has a good youth program but it's not close to being the best in the state. 1A is down because other parts of the state don't produce serious teams. For example, if you live in Surrattsville school district and you're a good player you're going to play for a private school or a 4A school. Fort Hill can win easily 1A for the next 5 years in a row.

 

[BoyznBlue]

Its sad too. There are some good young kids that play for Allegany's feeder teams. The only time there is ever a connection between those kids and Alco football is if those kids go to Allegany's football camp.

Down here, before the season starts the local high schools come to the field for one day and bring their coaches and work out all the kids, especially the older kids. For example, one day DeMatha will come, maybe the next week Wise will come for a day, then the Douglass coaches come for a day. The kids like it - it gives them a break from the youth league coaches - and it gives the high school coaches a chance to see (and recruit) the kids.

 

[BrianH1974]

FH didn't join 1A until 2005. What's crazy is that 9 out of the last 10 years 1A titles have been won by either Dunbar, FH or Alco. What that tells me is that Class 1A has always been weak. Smithsburg and Boonsboro used to always play for the title. So saying 1A is really down is an incorrect assumption. It took FH and Dunbar to show how really weak it always was.

 

[Waggle Pass]

Cumberland has a good youth program but it's not close to being the best in the state. 1A is down because other parts of the state don't produce serious teams. For example, if you live in Surrattsville school district and you're a good player you're going to play for a private school or a 4A school. Fort Hill can win easily 1A for the next 5 years in a row.

No one said the youth program was the best in the state.

 

[FHHSAHS]

How many of these 1A teams from across the state are losing to other 1A teams?

Is it possible that these 1A teams have less than stellar records because they play in conferences with big and/or stronger large schools? I know the MVAL is defunct...but stick FH in a conference with Linganore, TJ, South High, Middletown, etc...and they may have 3 or 4 losses more frequently...but STILL be a pretty formidable 1A team.

I seem to remember Joppatowne winning a state title maybe 10ish years ago with a 6-4 or 5-5 record. Mainly because they play tougher competition throughout the year.

 

[FortHillFan89]

Crapping where we eat is crazy.

 

[westernMD]

The Alco dynasty was primarily won in 2A as 6 of their 8 titles were won in 2A. In the 70's and early 80's only 4 teams per class made the playoffs meaning you pretty much had to go 10-0 or 9-1 to even make the playoffs. They expanded to 8 teams in the mid 80's but you still needed to go no worse than 8-2.

I'm proud of the FH program and what Coach Apple has been able to do but I must admit I wish FH could play in 2A. I believe they would have won the 2A title last year. 1A is no competition for them right now. Comes back to if you would rather be the big fish in the small pond or the small fish in the bigger pond.

I'm Big Blue through and through but I would like to see them consolidate and have 2 county schools, one 3A and one 2A. That would make for much better football.

 

[FHHSAHS]

I'm proud of the FH program and what Coach Apple has been able to do but I must admit I wish FH could play in 2A. I believe they would have won the 2A title last year. 1A is no competition for them right now. Comes back to if you would rather be the big fish in the small pond or the small fish in the bigger pond..

Kind of a backhanded compliment. It doesn't come back to if you would rather be one or the other, it comes back to playing where you are placed against the other teams in the same classification. Mayyyybe Fort Hill could have won 2A last year, my guess is, not. Douglass PG was pretty tough. Through the Middletown years prior to that? Again, maybe? But it serves nothing to say "I wish (insert school) could play in a higher class." Why? To see them lose? Who thinks like that? I don't disagree that Fort Hill is playing far better than most 1A schools right now, but that's not Fort Hill's fault. They are on a good tear...much like Allegany was through the 80's and early 90's. Why punish Fort Hill or any other team because they are doing it right, when the others are not? I don't wish FH was in 2A, I wish 1A was consistently tougher. But I'm not going to wish Fort Hill out of their element. Only someone from the outside would make that suggestion. At least this way there is a traditional favorite that people can strive to beat in their class. Just like Dunbar was prior to jumping up to 2A.

But, look, time is fickle... as good as Alco was in their heyday, where are they now? 10 years with no championship ties their longest dry spell since the MPSSAA was formed - and if they don't get there this year, it will be the longest stretch in 40 years. This is just Fort Hill's heyday, and it so happens to be hitting at the right time. 15 years from now, we could be having this same discussion about the Sentinels, remember back to when they won 2, 3 or however many championships in a row, etc....

1A needs to step up their collective game...Fort Hill doesn't need to be moved. It was a mere 3 years ago that Fort Hill was losing to Brunswick in the regionals or to Perryville in the semi's the year before that. You're ready to throw the baby out with the bathwater because Fort Hill has won two titles in two years, forgetting that they hadn't won a title prior to 2013 since the late 90's? So they may win another championship or two over the next few years...then what? Enjoy the ride, it ends. As an Alco fan, you should realize that.

 

[Waggle Pass]

"I wish (insert school) could play in a higher class." Why? To see them lose? Who thinks like that?"

All the Fort Hill haters.

 

[bleedred]

FHHSAHS said it best, I don't like a sub 500 team getting into the playoffs but that's the way the system is set up. However, for anyone to infer that the 1A is up or down in any given year is absurd in that it's an argument that no one can win. Every class in every State will have it's share of great teams and it's share of very poor teams. The catch here is that larger schools, by numbers alone will tend to have more athletes. The problems really pop up when people get on here and start spouting off without doing a little homework. Beall, I'm going to pick on you a little. You mentioned the "big boys" who left 1A, let's take a look at them.

First, Joppatowne is a 1A team, they're 2-8 not much of a big boy there. In the last three years, Mountain Ridge is 4-6 against 1A teams. (This year they are 0-2 with only Fort Hill as a 1A team to play) And the statement about Ridge making the playoffs most years was miss leading. The fact is that in the five years that the Ridge competed in 1A, they made the playoffs twice. That's less than half of the time. Catoctin has done better than the Ridge but not much. They have made the playoffs once, losing in the first round, but that happens to them more than it doesn't. In the seven years before they went 2A, they were a combined 50-29, made the playoffs five times, losing in the first round 3 times, the second round once, and of course winning the title once. While they were a player, I wouldn't consider them a powerhouse. Lastly there's Dunbar. This will be the third year that they've been gone from 1A. Looking at the last two years; in 2014, Dunbar played for the State 2A Championship and lost. But last year they also lost to an Edmonson team that lost to Douglas by 40+ points. Fort Hill beat that Douglas team. The year before, the Poets lost to Douglas, and yes, FH beat that same Douglas team in the Championship. The bottom line is that teams have good and bad years, and faces tend to change. Right now, Fort Hill is doing a lot of things right and it's showing on the field. In the next few years, it could be Northern in the drivers seat, and the list of sub 500 teams will change again. And of course, there will be a sub 500 team in the playoffs. But it doesn't mean that the whole class will be up or down.

 

[KHSGT77]

This may have been answered already in this or another thread, but would there be any sub .500 teams if Maryland did not use the regional format?

 

[CometCrazy21]

Dunbar never played Douglass-B the last two years, but i get your point.

 

[bleedred]

Dunbar played and lost to Edmonson in 13 and 14, who lost to Douglas both years. I was thinking one thing but wrote something different. Sorry about that.

 

[beall02]

This may have been answered already in this or another thread, but would there be any sub .500 teams if Maryland did not use the regional format?

If the season ended today, then all 16 teams in 1A would having winning records, several by just one game, but all would have at least a 4-3 record.

We will see when the season ends. But multiple teams with a losing record will make the playoffs. I agree with what FHHSAHS said however, and it is a point that I forgot about, many teams downstate are stuck with playing teams several classifications above them due to conference schedules. I will see if I can take a deeper look at this more on Friday.

 

[beall02]

FHHSAHS said it best, I don't like a sub 500 team getting into the playoffs but that's the way the system is set up. However, for anyone to infer that the 1A is up or down in any given year is absurd in that it's an argument that no one can win. Every class in every State will have it's share of great teams and it's share of very poor teams. The catch here is that larger schools, by numbers alone will tend to have more athletes. The problems really pop up when people get on here and start spouting off without doing a little homework. Beall, I'm going to pick on you a little. You mentioned the "big boys" who left 1A, let's take a look at them.

First, Joppatowne is a 1A team, they're 2-8 not much of a big boy there. In the last three years, Mountain Ridge is 4-6 against 1A teams. (This year they are 0-2 with only Fort Hill as a 1A team to play) And the statement about Ridge making the playoffs most years was miss leading. The fact is that in the five years that the Ridge competed in 1A, they made the playoffs twice. That's less than half of the time. Catoctin has done better than the Ridge but not much. They have made the playoffs once, losing in the first round, but that happens to them more than it doesn't. In the seven years before they went 2A, they were a combined 50-29, made the playoffs five times, losing in the first round 3 times, the second round once, and of course winning the title once. While they were a player, I wouldn't consider them a powerhouse. Lastly there's Dunbar. This will be the third year that they've been gone from 1A. Looking at the last two years; in 2014, Dunbar played for the State 2A Championship and lost. But last year they also lost to an Edmonson team that lost to Douglas by 40+ points. Fort Hill beat that Douglas team. The year before, the Poets lost to Douglas, and yes, FH beat that same Douglas team in the Championship. The bottom line is that teams have good and bad years, and faces tend to change. Right now, Fort Hill is doing a lot of things right and it's showing on the field. In the next few years, it could be Northern in the drivers seat, and the list of sub 500 teams will change again. And of course, there will be a sub 500 team in the playoffs. But it doesn't mean that the whole class will be up or down.

*I will start off by stating that you are correct in the fact that Joppatowne is indeed in 1A and that is a fact in which I overlooked as I believe they were 2A as recent as a couple years back.

*I will continue by stating that no where in my statement above did I say that Mountain Ridge was a playoff regular while in 1A. I believe I stated that they were in playoff contention almost every year. If you look at the first five years, Mountain Ridge did only make the playoffs in 2 of those years. They did however have 7,7,4,9,9 wins in those years however. And minus the down year in 2009, the 4 win campaign, were in fact in the playoff talk until the final week of the season in all of the other four years. Missing them in 2007 and 2008 while making them in 2010 and 2011.

*I will agree with you on the fact that Catoctin has not had much playoff success minus the one year they won it. But to make it in 5 of 7 years in nothing to slouch on. I know several teams that would love to be able to say that. The point with them was the fact that losing them to a higher class has hurt 1A.

*I never said in my original statement that any of the teams I mentioned would be considered powerhouses. As I stated in the Catoctin statement, it was mearily a mention that losing those programs has definetly hurt 1A. I don't really see how someone could argue that it hasn't.

*And we can debate about Dunbar as much as we like, but winning 7 State Titles in 10 years in impressive no matter what way you choose to look at it.

*No one is taking anything away from Fort Hill and what they have accomplished in the past two years. As well as what they may accomplish in the next 3 to 5 years. The original statement was more towards the fact that 4 out of 12 teams that would currently qualify for the State Playoffs were under .500.

*If you look at my original statement the only thing I got wrong was stating that Joppatowne was in 2A when they are in fact in 1A. A simple oversight by me. Everything else in that statement is factual. I did do my homework before posting it on the site.

 

[Red Neck]

"I wish (insert school) could play in a higher class." Why? To see them lose? Who thinks like that?"

All the Fort Hill haters.

You sound just like Dave Christopher! He'd prefer to have the schedule stacked with Silver Oak-like teams and win 50-0 every week! IMO, FH football was much more interesting when in the old CVAL and we had a threat of a loss most weeks...

 

[Waggle Pass]

You sound just like Dave Christopher! He'd prefer to have the schedule stacked with Silver Oak-like teams and win 50-0 every week! IMO, FH football was much more interesting when in the old CVAL and we had a threat of a loss most weeks...

You couldn't be more wrong with the first half of your statement.

 

[bleedred]

Beall, the point that I was attempting to make was that none of these schools you mentioned would change the 1A Class. Even Dunbar, and lets face it, their 7 State Titles in 10 years is impressive, but they would have had trouble continuing that streak even if they were still in 1A. Anyway, this was a good thread as it sparked some discussion.

Good Luck tonight.

 

[nomad974]

One would think FH would want the rest of 1A to be more competitive if for no other reason than scheduling. If the majority of other 1A teams were, or at least believed, they would be competitive vs FH, that would potentially alleviate the late in the year scramble to fill a 10 game sched.