MARYLAND FOOTBALL
- Thread starter purpleace
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Seems that the young man was out of shape... but, I also read that the staff kept trying to 'walk him around' instead of immediately getting him cooled down. I also understand there was no autopsy; for an unnatural death one would think this would be a given. Weird 'goings on' down there.
Family didn't want an autopsy, their right to have one or not but it is odd not to so one. Then the other day a report from an unnamed source came out on ESPN saying the Maryland coaches were mean to the players so I guess Maryland AD decided it was time to try to nip it in the bud and get to the bottom of everything. It's a shame bc I felt Maryland football was starting to turn the corner brining in some really good classes but this has the potential to derail everything very quickly
The family hired a law firm. I guess they figure they can get a settlement without proof of cause of death. I mean, there may be contributory factors.... ill health or drugs the night before... and so forth. I know each athlete passed a physical, but the last 24 hours could be critical.
Also, the mean to issues I read seem really petty. After all, these are college age 'yutes' who go from being wild to heavy discipline in order to play football at this level.
One issue was forcing an overweight player to eat a candy bar while the team worked out.... Oh! The shame of it all! The candy bar bit was right out of Full Metal Jacket.
I think it is important to understand that the progressive left wants to end this game. Sure, there appears to be negligence by the staff. But the lack of an autopsy and the crap about being mean looks to be the real story here.
Have to agree here with Lag. Hard to prove cause of death due to no autopsy. What is damaging to the Maryland staffers is the hour that nothing was done. Also the statements by past and current players about the "challenge the manhood" culture by the staff will force the AD to fire those involved.
If someone was gonna politicized a player's death, you knew it was gonna be a member of the alt-right.
Did you really just laugh at a player dying because of a scene you saw in a Hollywood movie? Can it be a surprise that a failed reality TV actor was elected president when so many on the right live in fantasy worlds where Hollywood is real?
You were either comparing a kid being forced to lift until he passed out to a movie or to the marine Corp. Both are ludicrous.
It would be so nice to be able to enjoy sports without the right forcing politics into them.
Alt-who? Alt-Wha? Whatever. No need to get all pestilential about it. The fact remains that progressive... liberal... pick your syntax... has campaigned against 'male aggression' since they have been able to shout it enough times to get popular coverage. This then translated into additional coverage of football injuries: since about 2011 it's been heavy-up on Alzheimer's and other memory-related diseases. (And wasn't there a move in MD to curtail youth football?)
"Did you really just laugh at a player dying..." Ugh, no. Looks strikingly like a case of you conjuring up something in order to argue against it. My comment about the candy bar was directly aimed at the media side issue of how abusive the MD program is to athletes. They... not me.... They used the candy bar example as one of being mean. Gimme a frickin' break. They... the media... not me.... They used a ludicrous example - one meant to be funny - straight out of Full metal Jacket. They.... not me.... are opportunistically dancing on the young man's grave. I should be thanked for pointing it out.
Many, many coaches I played under from 2nd grade to college could never coach today due to a lack of sensitivity. It's almost like when you see everyone smoking in the 1950s...in the movies, in the hospitals, you name it. It is not kosher today. Times change.
Although I have to say that I was unaware of the lack of an autopsy. Wow, that's big and possibly a case of trying to hide a pre-existing health issue. Can't believe that part.
Although I have to say that I was unaware of the lack of an autopsy. Wow, that's big and possibly a case of trying to hide a pre-existing health issue. Can't believe that part.
Yes, times have changed. One change is that we Boomers on average are much smarter than Millennials. It's because our parents let us go anywhere... swim anywhere... jump off anything... play unsupervised with firecrackers, firearms and knives: we are smarter because our generation's idiots did not survive.
I was called a yellowbelly on the C team at age 6-7 lol. And my parents told me to get tougher. They didn't request a meeting with the pee wee raiders coaching staff. For this I am thankful. Times have changed though. That philosophy is in the past. Like being given smelling salts to wake me up after Getting knocked silly. There was no concussion protocol like there is now.
You didn't get knocked silly , you got your "bell rung". And you are correct, there was no concussion protocol. Coach Paul "Bear" Bryant never allowed water on his practice field because he felt that it made the team weaker. Over the years, science and experience have changed the way we do a lot of things! CTE and the doctors have shown successive concussions is a bad idea. We learned about the importance of rehydration and the Florida Gators discovered their players performed better in the later stages of hot, humid games drinking Gatorade. Science has changed a lot with football and there will certainly be things in the future we discover we were doing wrong. But there are always going to be outliers and anomalies in sports and unfortunate things that happen. Had 6 or 7 players met the same fate, then something is wrong for sure. Sometimes its just as simple as that, things happen in life. Prayers to the young boys family.
I remember playing 'little league' when throwing at the batter was part of the game. When I got 'clunked' I was told not to show that it hurt. One coach had boxing gloves for players to work out their differences.
My parents went through the depression. My father was trapped in Bastogne - he saw real Nazis. My folks were hard-scrabble from the farms and mines. I saw my 85 year old grandmother walking behind a single-bladed plow pulled by a mule...."I'm only puttin' in a small field this year," she said.
There is no argument that heatstroke killed the player but there was also no autopsy to determine if there was anything in his system that could have led to heat sensitivity. There are certain diuretics, antidepressants and blood pressure meds that can cause problems, not just illegal drugs.
While reading some articles there are statements that heat related football deaths have risen.
One report states: 1960-2009 = 123
Another: 1995-2015 = 61
There appears to be a slight increase but why: is it related somehow to higher temperatures on average? nutrition,? something else? With the higher awareness and limits that have been placed on practicing in heat (gear not permitted at certain temps in, etc) why is there an increase? Is the overall number of players playing the game related to the nominal number of deaths?
And to add to the complexity, I just read an article last week that "overhydration" caused two football deaths this year.
Anecdotally, most of the these guys I have heard about dying in the last few years have been big whoppers over 300 lbs, which an old friend in the field of sports training advised that excess adipose tissue retains heat so the guys with more fat are at higher risk.
A rational person would think, too, that after he had a seizure, a call to 911 should have been made right there instead of an hour later, if that is what really happened based on what the family lawyer states in one of the ESPN reports. However, another article I read stated there are no witnesses validating the lawyer’s claim. I agree, an autopsy should have been done but I guess a coroner cannot overrule the family. However, this ought to be a contentious factor in any civil suit.
While reading some articles there are statements that heat related football deaths have risen.
One report states: 1960-2009 = 123
Another: 1995-2015 = 61
There appears to be a slight increase but why: is it related somehow to higher temperatures on average? nutrition,? something else? With the higher awareness and limits that have been placed on practicing in heat (gear not permitted at certain temps in, etc) why is there an increase? Is the overall number of players playing the game related to the nominal number of deaths?
And to add to the complexity, I just read an article last week that "overhydration" caused two football deaths this year.
Anecdotally, most of the these guys I have heard about dying in the last few years have been big whoppers over 300 lbs, which an old friend in the field of sports training advised that excess adipose tissue retains heat so the guys with more fat are at higher risk.
A rational person would think, too, that after he had a seizure, a call to 911 should have been made right there instead of an hour later, if that is what really happened based on what the family lawyer states in one of the ESPN reports. However, another article I read stated there are no witnesses validating the lawyer’s claim. I agree, an autopsy should have been done but I guess a coroner cannot overrule the family. However, this ought to be a contentious factor in any civil suit.
after reading all the articles on this thing, it's sad this kid died and it sucks that one of the trainers said drag him off but it has happened for year. Crazy there was no Autopsy...
Now to the complaints from players,ex players and former staff members...
The Coaches yell at them, make them eat until they are sick or knock food from there hands....
REALLY????????????? this has been going on for 70+ Years.... this is FOOTBALL Not liberal ball room dancing
I think it's funny ESPN did their story like they have never heard of this type of stuff from Coaches, like something criminal is going on at Maryland that doesn't happen everywhere else.
Liberals are ruining sports just like they have put this Country in the hole, at this point they don't understand illegal, they don't agree with laws so they decide to do what they want and think everyone is supposed to get exactly the same thing in every aspect in life, next thing they will do is force Restaurants to weigh each piece of food sold so that one is not different than the others.
They think there is some magical wand to get rid of everything they don't like and they honestly don't understand unless something is law Nobody cares what they think on these issues. When these NFL players kneel they say it's because of Equality and Racism.... really? Football players that make Millions? Everyone has the same Opportunities in America, we are all free to go where we want, work where we want and pretty much do as we want. How much Greater Can it get????????????
Now to the complaints from players,ex players and former staff members...
The Coaches yell at them, make them eat until they are sick or knock food from there hands....
REALLY????????????? this has been going on for 70+ Years.... this is FOOTBALL Not liberal ball room dancing
I think it's funny ESPN did their story like they have never heard of this type of stuff from Coaches, like something criminal is going on at Maryland that doesn't happen everywhere else.
Liberals are ruining sports just like they have put this Country in the hole, at this point they don't understand illegal, they don't agree with laws so they decide to do what they want and think everyone is supposed to get exactly the same thing in every aspect in life, next thing they will do is force Restaurants to weigh each piece of food sold so that one is not different than the others.
They think there is some magical wand to get rid of everything they don't like and they honestly don't understand unless something is law Nobody cares what they think on these issues. When these NFL players kneel they say it's because of Equality and Racism.... really? Football players that make Millions? Everyone has the same Opportunities in America, we are all free to go where we want, work where we want and pretty much do as we want. How much Greater Can it get????????????
The one thing you forget us that the Boomers raised millenials. You have to remember that boomers are the most entitled, unproductive generation in US history. What type of children did you expect them to raise?
But isn't that better than the right saying you can't be a man unless you beat your wife or die playing football? Its not liberals fault your generation raised weak kids. Trump won the election so we obviously aren't a liberal country, but its nice to know that you play the same cards as he does.
I struggle to understand your connection between factual brain damage and the media. Are you angry that facts are reported that you don't like because they disagree with your politics? That seems like much mote of a you problem.
A coach yelled at you once. We get it. Its what they do. A kid dies and your assumption is that they are all liberals and couldnt take it. God I miss they day when common sense was used regularly. I guess 2016 happened and that died.
I was hoping that the humor would show through to everyone.... Oh well. Yes we Boomers were entitled (and so forth) as compared to the generations before us: they suffered two world wars, the depression, the dust bowl and the worst flu epidemic in history (go to the Palo Alto, PA cemetery and look at entire families wiped out).
But to compare Boomer sense of entitlement and lack of productivity to Generation X or the Millennials is laughable; their only challenge by and large is to overcome pathological altruism - what with both parents working or divorced, they were raised by a state educational system, the media, psych pimps and net controlling corporate technocrats.
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Let's not forget guys... this is JUST a game. As much as I love sports, including College Football, it is only a game. And if the reports are correct, something criminal absolutely did happen on that field that day, those coaches have a responsibility in ensuring each and every one of those young men's health and well being, AND they did not act in accordance with that being their utmost priority. They acted as if Football is the ONLY thing they are there for and that is a tragedy. There is a fine line between "making a young man tough" and endangering his life. And they should never get close to that line in my opinion. I know that is not a popular opinion and I would like to say I do believe this country has gone to hell and a hand basket with this 90's babies and later ruining it. But sometimes you just have to say this should not have gotten to that point and it is a shame it did. I do believe no autopsy is strange. And that does point to something that maybe they are trying to hide. That doesn't change the fact that this young man was struggling that day, multiple people saw it and they refused to do anything about it.
Laughable? Why? What challenges did the Boomers go through? Having the government pay for their houses as children through the GI bill? Smoking dope at Woodstock?
And why do you think you Boomers are so bad at marriage, and so horrible at parenting that you want teachers and Hollywood to raise your kids?
Dealing with Boomers as patents is a bigger challenge for millenials that any boomer ever want through.
No, this would have all been avoided had boomers not allowed their children to be raised by liberals.
To quote myself, "It's sports dammit."
My comments about what the media has done to this situation has nothing to do with what the staff did to the young man that day.
In fact, I read that two players basically dragged the young man to complete the 10th lap. This was before the staff carried him around trying to get him to walk it off. If all of this is true. It's bad, really bad.
Yes, Boomers in general did just that. Fortunately, I saw the entire situation develop right before my eyes. My wife gave up a career as a flight attendant to be at home for our two sons. We were both highly involved in their lives.
When I started building early computers I taught my sons the same. I got them on the net when it was not the garbage dump you see now... they learned the difference. When they came home with crap from school, I told the boys, "Find out what the teacher wants and give it to them... you don't have to believe it.... never let your learning get in the way of your education."
And, of course, I am always proud to brag about my boys' VMI educations and their successful careers.
I'll just speak for myself. I left home at 18 with two pair of pants, two shirts and a college loan. I was able to get a steady ride to WFRB where I worked part time to help pay my way through.
I could only afford one meal a day, which amounted to two hotdogs at a little shop across a side street at the college.
Instead of being bitter I developed a live and let live attitude with pride that I was doing it on my own. This explains my being a libertarian.... I don't care if someone does drugs or owns a hundred guns and I don't believe in the 'social contract' crap where we try to tell everyone else how to live their lives.
So your individual case is special, but the one at Maryland isn't. Its all media and softness. Got it. I look forward to reading your next book, Dr. Spock.
Why get specific now? Don't you prefer speaking in generalizations? Again, how elite do you really feel you are, that no one (especially on the other end of the political spectrum) can do the same? Everyone else was brainwashed but you? No one else can work hard but you? No one else can raise independent children, but you?
And to day you aren't bitter is the funniest thing you've ever said on this forum. You complain as much, if not more, than anyone on here.
Once again, you are constructing your own negative reality and arguing against it. It's as though you can't grasp the point or you are living in an alternate reality.
I am not going to bother arguing against thoughts I never had or words I never posted.
Isn't constructive your own negative reality exactly what you do with your conspiracies about stage education systems and media? Isn't it exactly what you did with the Maryland football situation?
You might want to drop the multiple standards look. Its not a good one.
Maybe, not sure at all.
Right up from what used to be Pullen's elementary school. I checked Google Maps and boy have things changed... and of course, I haven't been around there is years.
It was across the street from the last dorm down Park Street, between the Alley and Park.
Update: Just had an old Frostburg grad say it was Fred's..... thanks
More update: Just read it was on the corner slightly up the street: Park becomes Center Street and it looks like a small foundation is on the corner.
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Here is you creating your own argumentative reality:
"So your individual case is special, but the one at Maryland isn't. Its all media and softness. Got it."
It is beyond senseless for me to discuss things with you that I did not think or post. You continue to project crap and try to debate your own crap.
It is boring and lacks wit.
I deserve a better discourse than:
"Dealing with Boomers as patents is a bigger challenge for millenials that any boomer ever want through....
...what you do with your conspiracies about stage education."
I suggest you spend a month or so carving your next post on a large-size boulder.
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Here's you blaming the media -
'My comment about the candy bar was directly aimed at the media side issue of how abusive the MD program is to athletes.'
Heres you blaming media and state education in the same sentence -
'what with both parents working or divorced, they were raised by a state educational system, the media, psych pimps and net controlling corporate technocrats.'
You seem to be getting lazier the more I show you up. You can't even check your own posts now.
You being embarrassed on here is nothing new, so I'm not sure why you insist on crying so wildly each time it happens. As I said, its just a bad look for you. You try to set yourself as so accomplished and proper, yet you break so easily.
Maybe try not contradicting yourself so often. That might help.
And you deserve nothing because you have earned nothing. You arent entitled to anything. No matter how much the people you vote for tell you otherwise.
"No matter how much the people you vote for tell you otherwise."
Feeling pretty bad right now aren't you. Sadly, you earned it.
Gastronomically speaking... I vote sausage, though chugging soda gets louder results.
First of all my condolences go out to the young man's family, his teammates and coaches. I saw in one of the replies statistics on heatstroke and heat related deaths in high school football. I have some observations on that based on my experience as a football and conditioning coach on the high school level.
I played high school football in the late 70's-early 80's and August practices went much like this:
- Two-a-day practices with each practice being 3 plus hours, 2 hour break in between practices
-Salt tablets were given before and during practice
-Water breaks were offered approximately every hour
-Strenous conditioning at the end of each double day practice
Occasionally one of the bigger players would struggle but I don't recall any heat-related issues that were serious.
Once I began my teaching career I coached other sports but was removed from the sport of football for 23 years. Several years ago I became involved in football once again, doing some coaching but involved heavily in the conditioning part of the program and the changes in today's player was striking:
-All athletes are much more sensitive to the heat, even your better conditioned athletes
-Today's athletes need more frequent water breaks and need to be very closely monitored when doing any type of strenuous conditioning. they can go from slightly struggling to severely struggling quickly.
- Of course the athletes with a higher body fat percentage really struggle in the heat and have to be watched diligently
I asked myself how did things change? It's not really any hotter or more humid? Practices are shorter, breaks between two-a-days are longer, why do so many athletes struggle despite having conditioning all year long? Which by the way wasn't offered when I played.
My guess would be the amount of time many kids spend inside in a air-conditioned environment would be one factor. The body needs to be in the heat to adapt to it, so being inside all day will only acclimate you to a 70 degree, low humidity day.
Kids in general move less in today's society mostly due to technology. In most neighborhoods you don't see as many kids outside playing as you did 20 years ago. Therefore they are generally less fit and less adapted to the conditions outside.
It was always interesting to talk to the athletes who handled the heat and humidity really well. Many of our kids were farm kids who made hay, cared for animals and worked outdoors all time. Others had lawn care businesses in which they did manual labor in the heat many days. Those were the kids who did very well and had the least amount of problems.
The bottom line is that anyone coaching today needs to know that the kids we coach now must be handled much differently than how many of us were coached or conditioned in the past.
Yea but you can eat sausage at breakfast and still taste it after the sun has gone down if the seasoning is right.
