Actually, it's the first time I have seen this in years. Also, seven straight over FH. Certainly, Allegany has compiled more state titles in basketball than FH. I think the last of theirs was in the 50's. Vandenberg and Tooey won a few in the 60's for the Campers. I believe the last one in town was 1993. I think it just shows the difference in basketball played here and moreover throughout the state. I'm thinking there has been at least 5 state titles in football since then. I think it is clear though, if Dunbar had not been in 1A for years that there would have been another state title is this town in basketball. I believe at one time Allegany and Fort Hill went to College Park about 6 straight years in the 2000's. Also Allegany lost one in 1994 to Dunbar. On a side note, when is the last time Allegany beat FH in wrestling??
Allegany with a 103 -76 lead on FH in basketball........
- Thread starter Snakeskin Cowboy
- Start date
Shows Allegany has good athletes and athletics is rising. Fh red glasses ppl only care about football they say because they lose in everything else great support huh? . I guess if Alco had a football coach FH ppl wouldnt care about football either. When Scaletta was bb coach Alco had many college level players and great talent. Alco would have had dominant teams but Scaletta was a terrible coach. That bb era reminds me of what footnall is going thru with Preskorn. Good players cant win with terrible coach.......Preskorn=Scalettay
Total area state basketball titles in last 60 years
Total area state basketball titles in last 60 years:
Valley - 5
Fort Hill - 1
Mt. Savage - 1
Allegany - 1
Bruce - 1
Yes the last basketball title in this area was Alco in 1993. To show how far basketball has fallen in Western Maryland - since that time of 1993 there have been 5 football state titles. 3 for Fort Hill and 2 for Alco. All of them in Class 1A except in 1997 when FH won 2A.
I would also add to the statement that if Dunbar had not been in 1A for years that there would have been another state title in this town in basketball to say - If Dunbar had not been in 1A for years that there would have been 4 more state football titles in this town for football. Fort Hill played Dunbar 5 times for a football title and Allegany played them once.
Total area state basketball titles in last 60 years:
Valley - 5
Fort Hill - 1
Mt. Savage - 1
Allegany - 1
Bruce - 1
Yes the last basketball title in this area was Alco in 1993. To show how far basketball has fallen in Western Maryland - since that time of 1993 there have been 5 football state titles. 3 for Fort Hill and 2 for Alco. All of them in Class 1A except in 1997 when FH won 2A.
I would also add to the statement that if Dunbar had not been in 1A for years that there would have been another state title in this town in basketball to say - If Dunbar had not been in 1A for years that there would have been 4 more state football titles in this town for football. Fort Hill played Dunbar 5 times for a football title and Allegany played them once.
Re: Total area state basketball titles in last 60 years
I would also add that if Maryland had state championships in football before 1974 like basketball had and like most other states had, both Fort Hill and Allegany would have a boat load of football titles. The reason Alco won all those basketball titles before 1960 was the same reason the Cumberland schools would have won a boat load of football titles. That is because Cumberland was the second largest city in Maryland (how Queen City got its name). In the 1940s, 50s and 60s - football was so dominant here compared to the rest of the state. Extremely dominant.
Can't Maryland ever get anything right?
It's the same reason the current Maryland football playoff system is still miles behind every other surrounding state. No wonder people leave.
This post was edited on 1/24 3:40 PM by TDHelmick
I would also add that if Maryland had state championships in football before 1974 like basketball had and like most other states had, both Fort Hill and Allegany would have a boat load of football titles. The reason Alco won all those basketball titles before 1960 was the same reason the Cumberland schools would have won a boat load of football titles. That is because Cumberland was the second largest city in Maryland (how Queen City got its name). In the 1940s, 50s and 60s - football was so dominant here compared to the rest of the state. Extremely dominant.
Can't Maryland ever get anything right?
It's the same reason the current Maryland football playoff system is still miles behind every other surrounding state. No wonder people leave.
This post was edited on 1/24 3:40 PM by TDHelmick
Re: Total area state basketball titles in last 60 years
This years Allegany bb team is fun to watch, the way they pass and play together. Dont think there is a 1a team in MD that can match Alleganys starting five. They have two big boys that are both juniors, will be scary good next year. e.
This years Allegany bb team is fun to watch, the way they pass and play together. Dont think there is a 1a team in MD that can match Alleganys starting five. They have two big boys that are both juniors, will be scary good next year. e.
BrianH......Allegany won two titles in the 60's at least. I already
mentioned that. So your 1 would be wrong in the last 60 years....... 1963, 64 and 1993 to be accurate.
This post was edited on 1/24 6:09 PM by Snakeskin Cowboy
mentioned that. So your 1 would be wrong in the last 60 years....... 1963, 64 and 1993 to be accurate.
This post was edited on 1/24 6:09 PM by Snakeskin Cowboy
Re: Allegany won two titles in the 60's at least. I already
ok I didn't see 1963 and 64. So in the last 50 years Alco has one state bball title. LOL. Not sure I want to discuss anything concerning what happened prior to that when Walter Bowers and John Cavanaugh were winning state bball titles for both city schools. I mean if what happened around the WWII Korean War era is a mark for comparing anything that's pretty sad as to area bball is today.
FH hasn't beaten Alco in hoops in 2 seasons. Congrats.
ok I didn't see 1963 and 64. So in the last 50 years Alco has one state bball title. LOL. Not sure I want to discuss anything concerning what happened prior to that when Walter Bowers and John Cavanaugh were winning state bball titles for both city schools. I mean if what happened around the WWII Korean War era is a mark for comparing anything that's pretty sad as to area bball is today.
FH hasn't beaten Alco in hoops in 2 seasons. Congrats.
Hey BrianH Funny about you one sport FH fans.....
Did you know in the last 38 years FH had two state football titles?? LOL to you.That is probably what is most sad for you FH fans. You had as many as Valley. I guess since you've won two more in 40, that makes one every 10 years. Not like that's dominance is it? Guess what? Since state titles are now important to you, it is 8-4, but who is counting right? I mean we almost have to go back 40 years for your first. 21 years later for your second. Quite an accomplishment. Glad you've gone back to back. I hope it smooths over the fact you still trail Allegany in football,basketball and baseball titles. No matter when they were won. By using your metrics, the New York Yankees would have to wipe out 20 of their 27 baseball championships because they haven't come in the last 50 years. Man, it really eats at you all don't it? I'm sure all the people who played on state championship teams still consider them state titles don't they? 50 years from now, will they still count FH's back to back titles? Will you then have caught Allegany yet? Regardless if they were 60 ,70 or 80 years ago. The title says Allegany or Fort Hill. Athletes participated and played for them. They can't take them away when people like you try to minimize them. That is it. Now those are some more facts to chew on. Twist them anyway you like. Listen it would be better now if you change the conversation about the football record between the two schools. That is all you got. I'm done with you...........
Did you know in the last 38 years FH had two state football titles?? LOL to you.That is probably what is most sad for you FH fans. You had as many as Valley. I guess since you've won two more in 40, that makes one every 10 years. Not like that's dominance is it? Guess what? Since state titles are now important to you, it is 8-4, but who is counting right? I mean we almost have to go back 40 years for your first. 21 years later for your second. Quite an accomplishment. Glad you've gone back to back. I hope it smooths over the fact you still trail Allegany in football,basketball and baseball titles. No matter when they were won. By using your metrics, the New York Yankees would have to wipe out 20 of their 27 baseball championships because they haven't come in the last 50 years. Man, it really eats at you all don't it? I'm sure all the people who played on state championship teams still consider them state titles don't they? 50 years from now, will they still count FH's back to back titles? Will you then have caught Allegany yet? Regardless if they were 60 ,70 or 80 years ago. The title says Allegany or Fort Hill. Athletes participated and played for them. They can't take them away when people like you try to minimize them. That is it. Now those are some more facts to chew on. Twist them anyway you like. Listen it would be better now if you change the conversation about the football record between the two schools. That is all you got. I'm done with you...........
Re: Hey BrianH Funny about you one sport FH fans.....
No problem: 53-32-4 FH football
9 out of the last 10 head to head
All time area best 28 in a row
Things sure have changed now that FH is in the same classification when it comes to titles. Now go move to 2A and play Dunbar 5 times to win a title.
You started it bud. Couldn't just talk about Alco recent hoops success but had to throw out records concerning FH. I get FH fans do the same but don't think u won't get a rebuttle. Geez.
This post was edited on 1/25 3:01 PM by BrianH1974
No problem: 53-32-4 FH football
9 out of the last 10 head to head
All time area best 28 in a row
Things sure have changed now that FH is in the same classification when it comes to titles. Now go move to 2A and play Dunbar 5 times to win a title.
You started it bud. Couldn't just talk about Alco recent hoops success but had to throw out records concerning FH. I get FH fans do the same but don't think u won't get a rebuttle. Geez.
This post was edited on 1/25 3:01 PM by BrianH1974
Re: Total area state basketball titles in last 60 years
Basically it was Western MD, Montgomery County, private schools and the City schools. Since the City schools weren't part of the MPSSAA, it was probably about 10% of MPSSAA membership playing football before 1965 or so. Why football didn't catch on in most of MD like it did in the rest of the nation, I have no idea, but the MPSSAA actually put playoffs in pretty quickly once they had enough members playing football to merit it.
It would have been cool to see some games between the MSA A champions (City or Poly most years) and Fort Hill/Allegany when those schools would have been comparable in size.
This post was edited on 1/25 4:52 PM by eaglesinsider
Most of the public schools in the state didn't start playing football until the mid-late 60s. Most of the public schools that were playing were the Baltimore City schools playing in the MSA with the private schools. Baltimore County, Howard, Anne Arundel and the Eastern Shore didn't start till 1965 or so. Westminster was the only school in Carroll playing football until 1968.Originally posted by TDHelmick:
I would also add that if Maryland had state championships in football before 1974 like basketball had and like most other states had, both Fort Hill and Allegany would have a boat load of football titles. The reason Alco won all those basketball titles before 1960 was the same reason the Cumberland schools would have won a boat load of football titles. That is because Cumberland was the second largest city in Maryland (how Queen City got its name). In the 1940s, 50s and 60s - football was so dominant here compared to the rest of the state. Extremely dominant.
Can't Maryland ever get anything right?
It's the same reason the current Maryland football playoff system is still miles behind every other surrounding state. No wonder people leave.
This post was edited on 1/24 3:40 PM by TDHelmick
Basically it was Western MD, Montgomery County, private schools and the City schools. Since the City schools weren't part of the MPSSAA, it was probably about 10% of MPSSAA membership playing football before 1965 or so. Why football didn't catch on in most of MD like it did in the rest of the nation, I have no idea, but the MPSSAA actually put playoffs in pretty quickly once they had enough members playing football to merit it.
It would have been cool to see some games between the MSA A champions (City or Poly most years) and Fort Hill/Allegany when those schools would have been comparable in size.
This post was edited on 1/25 4:52 PM by eaglesinsider
Re: Total area state basketball titles in last 60 years
Good point eagle. On that same note I would be curious to see how many teams surrounding states had like WV and PA in those early years. I know in WV they started declaring state football titles in 1937 by a voting panel. But by 1947 they broke into to classifications and started declaring a true champion. Locally in 1956 Keyser won a state title. Some of those years there probably was around 20 schools playing football (not sure). But they still figured a way to develop a championship.
LINK: WV STATE CHAMPIONSHIP HISTORY
In PA they really didn't start a true official state championship system until 1988 as other districts had their own set up prior to that. Although Windber HS who was at my Queen City Quad in 2009 has several officially recognized state titles dating back to 1931.
Good point eagle. On that same note I would be curious to see how many teams surrounding states had like WV and PA in those early years. I know in WV they started declaring state football titles in 1937 by a voting panel. But by 1947 they broke into to classifications and started declaring a true champion. Locally in 1956 Keyser won a state title. Some of those years there probably was around 20 schools playing football (not sure). But they still figured a way to develop a championship.
LINK: WV STATE CHAMPIONSHIP HISTORY
In PA they really didn't start a true official state championship system until 1988 as other districts had their own set up prior to that. Although Windber HS who was at my Queen City Quad in 2009 has several officially recognized state titles dating back to 1931.
Re: Hey BrianH Funny about you one sport FH fans.....
Gee, I don't know. Maybe they should put an asterisk on the 28 in a row because it is basically two back to back undefeated seasons when you add so many playoff games. In terms of back to back undefeated seasons including playoffs you have FH with two: 57-58, 2013-2014; Seneca Valley has two: 76-77, Alco has one 41-42.... But get this: Georgetown Prep has three 86-87-88 and Seneca Valley also has three 97-98-99.
What does it mean? Oh, I don't know. It is just a collection of numbers. Young men go to the schools, play the game and pile up memories. When it's done, it's done.
Oh, I was also researching the state record for most consecutive wins by a larger school over a smaller one. I am sure there is one because the numbers keep getting touted in this forum. Can't seem to find it though. Maybe there is no record like that kept. So, consecutive wins by a larger school over a smaller one is statistically meaningless.
This post was edited on 1/25 10:58 PM by Lagmeister
Gee, I don't know. Maybe they should put an asterisk on the 28 in a row because it is basically two back to back undefeated seasons when you add so many playoff games. In terms of back to back undefeated seasons including playoffs you have FH with two: 57-58, 2013-2014; Seneca Valley has two: 76-77, Alco has one 41-42.... But get this: Georgetown Prep has three 86-87-88 and Seneca Valley also has three 97-98-99.
What does it mean? Oh, I don't know. It is just a collection of numbers. Young men go to the schools, play the game and pile up memories. When it's done, it's done.
Oh, I was also researching the state record for most consecutive wins by a larger school over a smaller one. I am sure there is one because the numbers keep getting touted in this forum. Can't seem to find it though. Maybe there is no record like that kept. So, consecutive wins by a larger school over a smaller one is statistically meaningless.
This post was edited on 1/25 10:58 PM by Lagmeister
Valley still tied with FH and Alco
FH is the only school to win a 3A (known as A in those days) title and 1 in 2A. Alco won 6 of their 8 in 2A. So if you really want to be factual, both Alco and FH have won the same amount of state titles as Valley in 1A (or C as it was called in Valley's days). Valley-2, Alco-2, FH-2.
I remember when Valley was winning Class C (1A) state titles, Alco and FH fans downplayed it, as if it were the minor leagues as Alco and FH were competing in 2A and 3A against much tougher competition. Now that FH is winning 1A titles, it's the Super Bowl. Funny how one's perspective changes over time. Neither Alco nor FH has dominated 1A the way many thought they would. The Dunbar factor was a big reason but Alco and FH have lost to other teams in the 1A playoffs, including to each other. The last team to beat FH was Brunswick in the 1A state playoffs and they lost to Allegany in 2009 when FH had a team that should have won a state title. Catoctin won it that year, not Dunbar. And Allegany has been very disappointing in recent years, missing the playoffs or bowing out in the first round.
FH is the only school to win a 3A (known as A in those days) title and 1 in 2A. Alco won 6 of their 8 in 2A. So if you really want to be factual, both Alco and FH have won the same amount of state titles as Valley in 1A (or C as it was called in Valley's days). Valley-2, Alco-2, FH-2.
I remember when Valley was winning Class C (1A) state titles, Alco and FH fans downplayed it, as if it were the minor leagues as Alco and FH were competing in 2A and 3A against much tougher competition. Now that FH is winning 1A titles, it's the Super Bowl. Funny how one's perspective changes over time. Neither Alco nor FH has dominated 1A the way many thought they would. The Dunbar factor was a big reason but Alco and FH have lost to other teams in the 1A playoffs, including to each other. The last team to beat FH was Brunswick in the 1A state playoffs and they lost to Allegany in 2009 when FH had a team that should have won a state title. Catoctin won it that year, not Dunbar. And Allegany has been very disappointing in recent years, missing the playoffs or bowing out in the first round.
Not as simple as that
You act like Alco had a dominant basketball program when Scaletta took over. That was not the case, the Alco program was in decline long before that, and why was it in decline? Football became king and some great athletes were encouraged not to play b-ball. Alco won 4 state football titles in the 1980's and another one in 1991. Plus they made it to the state finals in 2 other years in the 80's. The B-ball program suffered and in some ways was undermined. Then when the eldest Eirich took over the b-ball program in 1992-1993, the b-ball program had a renewal. Allegany b-ball was cool again. Football was no longer king.
Now you are seeing some of that at FH. Football has always been king at FH but they also had pride in their b-ball program. Now it seems FH is a football only school. They need a coach to come in and have an administration that is committed to making b-ball just as much a priority as football.
You act like Alco had a dominant basketball program when Scaletta took over. That was not the case, the Alco program was in decline long before that, and why was it in decline? Football became king and some great athletes were encouraged not to play b-ball. Alco won 4 state football titles in the 1980's and another one in 1991. Plus they made it to the state finals in 2 other years in the 80's. The B-ball program suffered and in some ways was undermined. Then when the eldest Eirich took over the b-ball program in 1992-1993, the b-ball program had a renewal. Allegany b-ball was cool again. Football was no longer king.
Now you are seeing some of that at FH. Football has always been king at FH but they also had pride in their b-ball program. Now it seems FH is a football only school. They need a coach to come in and have an administration that is committed to making b-ball just as much a priority as football.
Re: Total area state basketball titles in last 60 years
Baltimore County started football in 1966, after years of controversy over the issue. I don't know any other states where schools didn't pick up football until so late, it is really strange.
Lots of states began their football playoffs in the early 1970's.
Some schools had football teams in the early 1900's, dropped the sport (they played soccer in the fall instead) and re-started it. Frederick dropped football after the 1922 season due to lack of facilities and talent (they lost 100-0 to Gettysburg in their last game) and re-started in 1946. Annapolis dropped after the 1930 season and re-started in 1948. Their 1948 schedule included Cambridge, Havre de Grace, and Elkton, so there were a few teams playing around the state at that point. Montgomery County dropped the sport at some point and re-started in the 1940's.
Baltimore County started football in 1966, after years of controversy over the issue. I don't know any other states where schools didn't pick up football until so late, it is really strange.
Lots of states began their football playoffs in the early 1970's.
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